User talk:GoDai

Welcome
Hi, welcome to Tower of God Wiki! Thanks for your edit to the Mule Love page.

Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! -- Tofu21 (Talk) 07:13, June 12, 2012

Re: Infobox, Korean names, etc.
Hi GoDai, thanks and welcome to the Wiki! ^__^

Yes, more help from people who can read Korean will be good. xD

Well, I do think that is a good idea and thanks for suggesting it. However, I'd like to discuss this suggestion with the other admins, if it's okay with you. :p I've already contacted them but some of them are busy, so it will take at least 3 to 4 days for them to read and reply.

Tofu21 08:23, June 12, 2012 (UTC)

Mistranslation?
Hey, welcome to the wiki, quick question would you mind translating the text in this image for me? It's from Tower of God, just need some confirmation on what it says, so if you could do that it'd be appreciated. Just click the word image to get to the image. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 08:24, June 12, 2012 (UTC)

Tuesday Translations
So you can read Korean then, ey? You could be a very valuable user - Would you mind providing us with rough translations of ToG every Tuesday or so? This could be great! Have a think about it for a while. :D

High Ranker 3 - User:Zahard 08:37, June 12, 2012 (UTC)

Just a brief summary every Tuesday (the day after the release) would be excellent. :D

High Ranker Number Three - Zahard 22:07, June 12, 2012 (UTC)

Korean names
Actually it was Androssi talking about Rachel. Thanks appreciate it :) &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 01:33, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

If I could find any I would, but if you want you can give us the Korean for the characters names so we can add it to the infoboxes? &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 05:22, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

That does help thanks :) &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 08:54, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Re: Translation sources?
Okay I assume the other admins have answered about the other stuff... that you asked me. 'Cos I let them see your message.

So yes, about the translations: we're using The Company's version. And all the English names are derived from that version.

About the Androssi thing... well, apparently, there was some other meaning: that Akryung was already with Rachel, when Androssi met them.

http://towerofgod.wikia.com/wiki/Q%26A

I don't remember where the original link correction was... lolz. Just gimme some time, if you wanna see it because yeah i'm a bit piled with editing the wiki.

Tofu21 10:31, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Weapons, and Phantaminum
Thank you, that was a quite important mistranslation so thanks :) &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 01:04, June 14, 2012 (UTC)

Creating those pages is a great idea and could you put the source to Phantaminum being an Exis on his page? &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 04:37, June 14, 2012 (UTC)

Confirmations
don't worry, we've already made the relevant corrections and put that in the Q & A page. I can't remember if I put that into Androssi's page... ugh, so many things to add into the Wiki. Thanks for taking the time to explain.


 * pants* Wow, you guys are going really fast... keep it up! :P

Also, can you confirm these 2 things? Take your time.

http://www.batoto.net/forums/topic/4283-what-was-the-power-flowing-into-baam-in-the-last-exam/page__view__findpost__p__97053

Yes, have you ever ever seen anything in the public blog entries about this? I was just curious.

http://www.batoto.net/forums/topic/1239-tower-of-god-titles-positions-definitions-more/page__st__40__p__16785#entry16785

Oh yeah, there's a lot of stuff I've yet to add about Positions. So, you don't need to translate all these things.

http://forums.mangafox.me/threads/368522-Additional-information-about-TOG-from-the-author-Spoiler

Meanwhile, I will continue doing what I do... combining some of the facts SIU has laid out and try to put it into context. There're so many things he doesn't tell people outright and he tends to scatter the clues all over. Like what else Guide does, the 120++ Rulers(because of that, I'd to revamp the entire Zahard Empire page and junk everything else), the chosen systems and so on. And it's torture. T.T

Tofu21 05:08, June 14, 2012 (UTC)

Re: Exis, etc
Thanks heaps! Any other handy things you might have would be greatly appreciated. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 06:23, June 14, 2012 (UTC)

Re: Strange Power, Confirmation Tasks
Yep, it's okay... take your time. There's a long time more before Part 2 even ends.

Tofu21 06:55, June 14, 2012 (UTC)

And about Baam and that strange power, I'll keep that in mind.

Tofu21 06:55, June 14, 2012 (UTC)

Translated page of SIU's notes
Ahhh erm, the info should... all go into individual pages on the Wiki.

Like: guardians page, shinhueh page, etc. Otherwise, we'll never be able to sort it out.

Unless you want to create a page, that's like a giant text dump or something. Or the page contain notes where the info is going into. Like: original raw link, what page translated info is found in, etc.

Also about names, is it possible to create a separate page 'cos just posting on each page isn't always advised? We might miss it out and forget to rename it.

Okay oops, so forgot to confirm this: the translations about the power thing... definitely are vague but also, hint at something else? Because this is what I want to confirm: is the direct translation right or wrong?

"btw The Company translations were a bit off in chap 65...in the company version Baam said 'a feeling as if a huge wave is flowing in' but the direct translation is 'a feeling as if a huge power is surging and flowing into me.' I think that might have confused some people."

http://www.batoto.net/forums/topic/4283-what-was-the-power-flowing-into-baam-in-the-last-exam/page__view__findpost__p__97053

The company's version keeps talking about a strange feeling, a strong wave, a certain strength.

http://www.batoto.net/read/_/31039/tower-of-god_v1_ch63_by_the-company

http://www.batoto.net/read/_/35369/tower-of-god_v1_ch65_by_the-company

Tofu21 23:42, June 14, 2012 (UTC)

Oh I see now... about this page thing. It's a good idea but do mention to the other admins, so they can weigh in on it.

But the problem is: a lot of users just won't find the Page. Unless you want to put in all notes into the Shinsoo page as well. Do you intend to do that?

Oh yes, sorry for giving you yet another thing to do but... later on, can you check out my latest comment on the Reel Inventory page. It seems there's some problem now: the Arms inventory seems the same as the Reel inventory.

Because Yuri Zahard's arms inventory had a reel function. At the same time, the pinned threads in the Batoto forum mention Fisherman has Reel inventory + Arms inventory + Armor inventory. damnit, I gave up trying to check.

Tofu21 01:03, June 15, 2012 (UTC)

If you look at Androssi's and Anak's inventories, they also have a reel function. They're capable of storing weapons. Same for Wangnan's.

Do contact Zahard and Urek. They're the 2 active admins... Baam25th is kinda busy sometimes.

I'll reply to the rest later. ^^

Tofu21 04:27, June 15, 2012 (UTC)

Info page on blog
Yeah you can do that it's a good idea :) &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 07:36, June 15, 2012 (UTC)

Go here http://towerofgod.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:GoDai and create a blog post. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 08:18, June 15, 2012 (UTC)

So far it's pretty good ^.^ remember the sources though and I can read a wall of text I don't need CTRL+F :P &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 10:25, June 15, 2012 (UTC)

Maybe seperate them according to category for instance I noticed that source page you provided has about 12 headings, maybe one page for each? &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 23:49, June 15, 2012 (UTC)

Yeah that works ^.^ &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 00:24, June 16, 2012 (UTC)

' 비선별인원 '

그들은 헤돈에 의해 선별되지 아니하고,

탑의 문을 스스로 열고 들어온 사람들을 지칭한다.

대표적인 예로 펜타미넘, 엔류 , 우렉 마지노 , 밤 , 라헬 등을 뽑을 수 있다.

(자하드도 비선별인원이 맞지만, 그들이 들어올 시기에는 '비선별인원' 이라는 말 자체가 없었습니다.)

I think that's what you're looking for ^.^ &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 03:08, June 16, 2012 (UTC)

Just a quick message, when adding the translations of a characters name add it in a new section called Alternate Translations at the bottom of their page, thanks. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 06:10, June 16, 2012 (UTC)

Create a new section under the Notes and Trivia and then list them like so

Alternate Translations
In this example the page used is Phantaminum, if you think a name is actually incorrect, discuss a change with Zahard as he knows Korean and is the best admin for you to talk to about that, but first and foremost we use The Company's names, if you think the name is different just add it to the alternate translations section at the bottom of the page. Just add the pronunciation to the alternate translations section, also if a character has an info box, add the Korean into a new row of the box, if not just put it where you have been P.S we don't use the english names from the stat cards because I'm not aware of SIU's English ability.
 * Pentahmineom
 * Pentaminum

Yeah but for consistency's sake we keep the names as they are, the only chance for a name change might be for new characters, as we don't have to worry about the fanbase being used to the name yet, but yeah the alternate translations section is there to cater for the differences, I plan to add redirects at some point, also I appreciate the pronunciations it's great to have a better idea of how to say the characters' names. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 06:38, June 16, 2012 (UTC)

Re: Name Issues
As to the subject of names - I had the same problem at first too. However, my reccomendation is that you can place these names in brackets, Korean and then Revised Rominization, both in italic. The Company occasionally refers to us directly and includes us in the introduction of Tower of God's official translated upload, so we are inclined to use their translations as the main names for our pages. But go ahead with the directly translated names, like Sib Yi Soo. We do have to keep them in brackets though. One thing to remember is that The Company alters the names slightly so they sound more "audibly pleasing" spoken out for the English language. :D

High Ranker Number Three - Zahard 07:41, June 16, 2012 (UTC)

No problem! I do understand the problem you're talking about.

High Ranker Number Three - Zahard 07:47, June 16, 2012 (UTC)

Just want to say that you are pretty awesome :P (forgot the signature ._.)

Sniter 15:38, June 19, 2012 (UTC) Sniter

I give up!!!! Please add them later if you've the time.
I completely completely surrender...

Okay, I give up on trying to add Prince and Akraptor’s and Nya Nia's names… sheez, I can break down hanja since I’m Chinese but I’m not about to learn how to read them so I can romanise the names. >__<

Prince: 프린스 Hon Akraptor: 혼 아크랩터 Nya Nia: 냐 니아

Oh and I'm gonna scream. Why in the hell does Yeon family name read as 연 but not show up in his blog entries when I search for it? Anyways, I don't know what Yihwa's given name is...it's your turn now to go type them out lol....

I can tell all of these names... actually I found them by drawing out Miseng's name and inputting it into SIU's blog and searching:

여 미생(Yeo MiSeng) 여 고생(Yeo GoSeng)

(강호량, Kang HoRyang)

I managed to discover a few days ago that Miseng and Goseng probably come from the same family and probably, same generation level since they share same characters for surnames and generation names, so I added that into their pages. Well unless they all come from the same Place then I'll revise it.

Oh yes btw, a word of warning: my Chinese is horrendous so err yep, don't ask me to translate anything. I won't have any ideas at all.

Tofu21 19:32, June 19, 2012 (UTC)

a____a
hey man, thanks for all ur work! TOG is the most amazing manwha ever.

i was wondering, in ur last work u said that Give My Earth Back is openly avaible, i cant seem to find it, do you have a link where i can read it?

thanks :P


 * SIU's earlier works are credited to his previous username, inutero3334. The comics are here, but most have been taken down. inutero3334 만화.. Another problem: "Challenger" comics are not available from June 21 to 27 for technical problems :S. Wait until June 28 :P GoDai 22:30, June 21, 2012 (UTC)

Shinsoo-related Korean text
Hey, whenever you can get around to it (make sure you've finished studying first :P), can you have a look at the korean here, it's copied from a blog post from SIU it's about Shinsoo, early - mid May it was posted, anyways here's the link https://docs.google.com/document/d/16Fdhnu5Mp0NiHhArNbMjJAgMq1AnOQWAku_0sKTIRVY/edit?pli=1 &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 06:35, June 21, 2012 (UTC)

It's from the private blog I think, because the person I got it from has access to that. It may have to be left without a source until someone can get the link to it. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 23:59, June 21, 2012 (UTC)

Yeah you can translate, just put Source: SIU's Private Blog at the bottom of your translations. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 01:28, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

Great job, thanks for that ^.^ if I find any other interesting stuff, I'll let you know, but anyways hope your exam today goes well! &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 05:57, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

No problem and thanks for translating that, The Company collected the Korean, but the translation has been on hold for over a month, so I figured I'd ask you and well I'm impressed ^.^ Thanks for adding the info too :) I really want to learn Korean now >_< &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 06:45, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

Maybe you can teach me! :P I hear English is difficult to learn, what do you think? Also can you look over my edit to the Shinsoo page to make sure I didn't do any damage to the original meaning? Thanks &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 07:09, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

Ah okay, and just so you know, to my knowledge Baang and Room have been used interchangeably, but if you want to check for yourself here's a picture which should contain one of the words :P you can tell me which is used, http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/269/roomorbaang.png &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 08:11, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

So the two are effectively interchangeable, but Bang or Baang is more correct in this context (the context being ToG)? &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 09:08, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your tranlsations
I'll add the names and the moon stuff and other things soon after I recover from this horrible cough. I actually added the names wrongly lol much earlier before realising that crap, should've checked with you first.

Btw, most or all of the terms used on the Wiki reflect The Company's terms.

So, if we're going to divert from them"(if it's a mistranslation), we need to add notes so we don't confuse the users. They used "rooms", "dansoolsa", "wonsoolsa", "wave controller", "Miseng" and so on.

It's best if we don't divert too much unless it's a wrong translation. If it's just a different way of romanising a term, we can add as a alternate romanisation like "dansoolsa" vs "dansulsa". I know TC also has used "dansoolsa" before but they changed to "dansulsa".

They actually use Miseng but oh well... xP.

"Testing Administrator" is pretty much the same as examiner so we shouldn't divert, imho. And it's not that important.

Also, these are the terms TC uses:

http://www.batoto.net/forums/topic/1239-tower-of-god-titles-positions-definitions-more/

They've got other pinned threads(but not that relevant as the Q&A thread is just mainly for speculating, discussing theories and so on):

The Master blog translations thread isn't always up-to-date and the re-translated Top 15 profiles are up on Part 2 chapter pages: end parts.(I've added most of them... but not everything. Also, they haven't released no.1 to no. ? yet.)

http://www.batoto.net/forums/topic/4774-master-author-blogtranslations-thread-2-updated-2012-03-12/

This is the English version of TOG:

http://www.batoto.net/comic/_/comics/tower-of-god-r1

Also, I double-checked the Hanzi words you added/corrected on the Shinsoo page. They're correct. At least I remember some of my chinese characters(ugh so pathetic).

Tofu21 14:12, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

<p style="font-size:13px;">Well, I highly appreciate your translating efforts so far. Please keep them up! ^^ They're excellent and a great addition to this site.

I do understand your perspective as a translator and your interest in adhering to the most accurate terms. However, the Wiki is a reference site for those who've read the English comic(Batoto's version). These people are mainly or only familiar with the English terms, used by The Company. It's like some of the signs of a building are wrong but they've been in use for so many years, people would be confused if they're suddenly changed.

Please read the Master Blog thread, as it does indicate TC knows Wave Controller also = Wave Catcher and so on... but, they stuck to Wave Controller.

I feel there needs to be some leeway allowed, unless we want to confuse everyone. At least quite a few of the Korean loanwords don't adhere exactly to the original English or whatever pronunciations, don't they? Yet, there's accomodation for the wrong sounds, right? It's unlikely we'll hear the Korean government declaring they'll rewrite much of the language and insert many new sounds, so the Korean language can properly and accurately "import" all loan words. ^^;;

It's the same way for this Wiki, I think. There may be issues here and there but going gentle on errors, is better, no?

Tofu21 21:46, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

Bang =/= Room
Ah okay I understand now, I guess TC doesn't know SIU released the hanja for it.&quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 22:06, June 22, 2012 (UTC)

Youtube
Hey GoDai! Can you shoot me a youtube message to "ForgivenUnderGrace" please? There's something I need to talk to you about. You'll like it. It will mean we'll be able to play around with translations a bit as well. :D

High Ranker Number Three - Zahard 03:16, June 24, 2012 (UTC)

Changes
Well, even native English speakers can have problems when it comes to Asian names. Just one "ae" or other change and it throws people off. For people like me and you, we're used to it. But for the rest, it tends to confuse a lot of people greatly. After all, English has only 1 reading and that may even be the same for many or most European languages. Whereas for Asian languages, there're multple ways of romanizing things and people can go like "huh?" even when it's just one extra letter. :P

That's why we don't change around too much either. ;___; After all, I'd love to rename every darn thing for language consistency and so on but well... we gotta realise not everyone can figure out Korean has multiple readings and complex reading rules.

As for certain terms:quite a few of the readers don't count English as their 2nd/3rd language and they may not know Administrator has multiple meanings(synonym).

Also, Shinsoo must be capitalised because well, we count it as a "special term". I'll leave it to you to undo all the changes as I'm a bit tired right now. :P

Sorry for being sloowwww in replying. Damn, I don't want to become an ajumma

How do you young people manage to get the energy to run around like that?

Tofu21 14:19, June 24, 2012 (UTC)

Nah, it's okay... this arc hasn't even unfolded much yet so we've lots of time to take it a bit slow.

And really sorry for being long-winded. I wasn't too sure if you'd understand it. :P

As for quite a few of the terms, well... they're already in the master blog link.

Tofu21 02:48, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

Sure. :D http://www.youtube.com/user/ForgivenUnderGrace?feature=mhee

Just google "how to send a youtube message". It'll tell you :)

High Ranker Number Three - Zahard 08:34, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

Wangnan and Lurker
Can you translate this please? http://blog.naver.com/inutero3334/140162116166 &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 12:42, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

Thank you! I'm a little happier with SIU now after reading that ^.^ &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 22:44, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

Robert Aisand
EDIT: Hey GoDai, would you mind checking SIU's blog for around the 8th, 9th and 10th of this month, to see if you can find anything about the <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:Verdana,Arial,Tahoma,Calibri,Geneva,sans-serif;line-height:normal;-webkit-text-size-adjust:none;">deputy director of Office of Ranker/Ranking Management, apparently named Robert Aisand? I wasn't told if it was private or not, but yeah.

&quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 06:03, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

Bugga, I got a brief translation of it, and I can't tell if the guy was just picking on Urek/over estimating Phantaminum (from someone who doesn't know he's an Exis)/or if he knows Phantaminum is an Exis. Ah well, thanks for looking, if it's on the private blog hopefully SIU releases it soon I wanna get a glimpse at the character haha. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 09:10, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

Hi, this is Tofu21... I managed to get the info about the Robert Aisend character off a Batoto forum member called Gizmos. She's access to the hidden blog(sorry, not he... oops, corrected my mistake).

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">로버트 아이샌드

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이명: 차가운 파도

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">나이: ???

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">키:1M 95cm

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">출생지: ???

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">포지션: ???

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">랭킹: ?

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">탑에서 가장 영향력 있는 단체 중에 하나인 '랭커 관리국'의 부국장.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(참고로 국장은 토미. 'tommi')

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">자하드조차 그 출생을 모를 정도로 베일에 쌓여져 있는 남자.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">뛰어나고 정확한 일처리 능력과 과묵한 성격 덕분에 '로보트 아이샌드' 라는 별명으로 불리기도 한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(한 때 공방에서 만든 사무용 인조인간이라는 소문이 돌기도 했으나 공방에서 '공식적'으로 부인했다)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">실제로 토미가 부르는 별칭은 '아이샌'

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">토미가 자하드의 명을 받아 랭커 관리국을 세울 때 가장 먼저 자리에 앉힌 인물로서

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">뛰어난 일처리 능력과 정확한 판단력, 카리스마를 가지고 있는 남자이다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">카리스마, 일처리, 판단력 따위 개나 줘버려라고 말하는 듯한 토미와는 정반대의 인물.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">매일 놀러다니는 토미를 대신해 언제나 묵묵히 일을 하고 있다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아이샌드는 엄밀히 따지자면 랭커가 아니지만 관리국에 채용되었기 때문에 랭커에 준하는 권리를 가지고 있다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">관리국에서 맡는 일은 주로 하이랭커들의 관리와 랭킹의 조정.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">어쩌면 탑에서 가장 중요한 권력을 가지고 있는 자라고 할 수 있다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">탑을 오른 적이 없기 때문에 어느 정도의 전투력을 가지고 있는지는 알 수 없지만

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">본인 말로 '태어나 한 번도 싸워본적이 없다'는 걸 보면 일반인 수준의 전투능력만을 가지고 있는 듯 하다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">하지만 그럼에도 불구하고 하이랭커들 앞에서도 전혀 기죽는 법이 없으며

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">오히려 그들을 압도하는 경우가 많다고 한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">일례로

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">팬타미넘보다 낮은 자신의 랭킹에 불만을 가진 우렉 마지노가

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">랭커 관리국에 침입해 아이샌드를 붙잡아 놓고 자신의 랭킹을 올리라고 협박한 적이 있었는데

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"내가 팬타미넘과 싸우는 걸 본 적이 있냐?"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">고 물어보는 우렉에게 잠시의 망설임도 없이

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"당신은 패배자(loser)가 될 것입니다."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">라고 딱 잘라 말해 충격을 받은 우렉마지노가 쓸쓸히 집으로 돌아갈 수 밖에 없었다고 한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그 후로 우렉 마지노는 윙트리 내에서 우렉 루저노. 루저렉 마지노, 우루저 멘탈 마지노선 등등으로 불리며 놀림 받았으며

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이 사건을 재구성한 코믹북, 유머책등이 제작되어 인기리에 판매될 정도였다고 한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(백련은 이 코믹스들이 우울증 치료에 큰 효과가 있을거라고 강력하게 주장했다.)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아이샌드의 트레이드 마크는 발 끝까지 내려오는 긴 은발의 머리카락인데

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">전체적으로 선이 살아있는 남성적인 외모와 어울리며 묘한 느낌을 준다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">풍채 또한 작은 편이 아니어서 키가 작은 토미와 함께 있으면

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">마치 아버지와 아들같아 보이기도 한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">앞에서 말했다싶이 아이샌드는 랭커가 아니기 때문에 랭킹에 포함되지 않는게 정상이지만

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">토미의 강력한 장난끼(?)로 인해 랭킹에 포함되게 되었다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">어느 날 토미가 아이샌드에게 자신의 랭킹을 매긴다면 어느 정도 순위를 주겠냐는 메세지를 보냈고

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아이샌드는 그에 대해 ? 라고 답장했는데

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그 것을 토미가 그대로 랭킹에 올려버린 것이다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">사실 아이샌드의 랭킹에 관해서는 의견이 분분한데

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">전투력을 제외한 순수 영향력 면에서는 퍼그나 10대 가문의 수장들과도 경쟁할 수 있다는 의견이 전반적이다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(참고로 토미는 랭킹에 포함되어 있지 않다)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">[출처] 인물도감 ? - 로버트 아이샌드|작성자 SIU

Also, a quick question about Wingtree's name...

(월하익송, Weolhaiksong; most likely 月下翼松; "The Winged Tree Under the Moon")

Btw, that's wingtree's name, right? ''翼 = wing, right? ''

But since 松(song) refers to a pine tree, would SIU not be making an allusion here? That the form of a tree with wings(as branches), resembles the form of a pine tree. Because tree actually means <span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:'TimesNewRoman';font-size:medium;line-height:normal;">樹 or <span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:'TimesNewRoman';font-size:medium;line-height:normal;">树(shu) in Chinese and I'm sure they'd call it another word in Korean.

http://www.mandarintools.com/cgi-bin/wordlook.pl?word=%E6%A8%B9&amp;searchtype=trad&amp;where=start

Also, not really sure why The Company called it "moonlight" instead of "moon".

Tofu21 12:50, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

Family systems and... trees
<p style="margin-top:1em;margin-bottom:1em;">About main/branch families: l'm quoting Chinese tradition here. The wife of the main family probably stayed together with the family head, together with her children, right? And the other wives either lived separately or together, right? Well, they didn't get to stay with the house head unless they were really favoured, right?

<p style="margin-top:1em;margin-bottom:1em;">Same for those males who were married to the female head, right? :P

I don't know if matriarchal systems existed in Korea/China but whatever, there's not much proof for that. Historians just keep unearthing information that complicate or contradict the entire issue but I don't know. I guess whatever the case, we can take that outside the Tower, they may practise matriarchal systems in some areas.

Oh boy... why so confusing. xD

Tofu21 15:15, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

Np, take your time translating 'cos you're still celebrating, right? :P How much soju did you drink?

Ah well, about WingTree: Ah, there's the similarity, I guess, it's just so darn similar to a pine tree. I'll just take your word for it, though and note SIU probably chose the name for another purpose.

http://peacockranch.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/pine-tree-10.jpg

Ah yes, lets just see if it's the male or daughter who carries on the family. Because of the Princesses system, the family would have problems if they put all their hopes into some daughter.

Tofu21 02:41, June 27, 2012 (UTC)

And yep, it's a good thing Gizmos... well, she was nice enough to give me the link. ^^

Tofu21 12:54, June 27, 2012 (UTC)

Oh man, you've been here for only a few days and your Talk Page is exploding. You've my sympathies, man. :P K can you give me the Korean characters and reading for "tree"? Trust me, I dare not blindly copy from endic.naver.com

Could be <span class="fnt_k06" style="font-family:gulim;font-size:13px;font-weight:bold;">나무 or anything else. Because I'm gonna be putting this stuff on the Wingtree page, if you think it's okay to do so.

Also, check this out: http://towerofgod.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Tofu21/Terms_used_by_The_Company (I just copied everything off some link)

Tofu21 06:06, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your effort in showing me there're so many terms. It makes complete sense after all, since well... Asian languages are so complex. ><;;

btw, how do you romanise these 2? I'm sorry, I doubt even if I master the alphabet, I can romanise it properly. Though I must say the Korean alphabet is a lot easier to learn than Chinese. So logical!
 * 나무 목, 木 I'm just coming up with things like (namu mog/mok, mu4)
 * 나무 수,c(namu su, shu4)

Tofu21 07:49, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Thanks so much. Haha, it took me about 15 to 20 mins to find an alphabet chart and then piece the sounds together because I didn't know anything about hangul before then. :P

Tofu21 08:34, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Here we go
<span style="font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif;">Compiled by GoDai and Tofu21:

If SIU wanted to use an ambiguous term like “tree”, he would’ve used 木나무 목, (mu4, nahmoo/namu). Or perhaps "樹, 나무 수(nahmoo/namu soo/su)". In Chinese, both "木(mu4)" and "樹(shu4)" refer to tree.

However, he specifically used "松 소나무 송(song1, soo/su manu shu)" where “松” and “소나무” mean “pine tree” in Chinese/Korean. And SIU didn’t use any other botanical terms to describe the Walhaiksong.

So, SIU is probably alluding to several imageries or meanings. The first being: the form of a tree with wings in place of branches resembles a pine tree. The others are unknown for the time being.

Also, Chinese is very heavy on context and tends to "exclude" characters so a phrase/sentence becomes more elegant. So direct translation isn't always advisable. Or else, we could end up with something like “Under the moon, a pine tree with wings.”

---

The above is going up on the Walhaiksong page. :P Also hahaha thanks... :P

Also, you've been doing a great job translating so far. I'm sure you'll get great results for your exams. Hwaiting! :D

I'd also give anything to see a bunch of pine trees with wings. Then, we could have a fun time watching demonic pine trees running away and hearing the owners scream: "Come back here, you rascal!" Then we could have turf wars too(the Grand Turf Wars of the Ultimate Pine Trees), provided they don't nuke the entire earth.

<span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Helvetica,sans-serif;background-position:initialinitial;background-repeat:initialinitial;">

Tofu21 09:37, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Also, it's time for me to scar people's eyes with these 2 sentences *snickers*:

<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:SimSun;mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;mso-ascii-theme-font: minor-latin;mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri;mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">月下，站一棵树. 有翅膀，非常相似松树.

<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:SimSun;mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;mso-ascii-theme-font: minor-latin;mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri;mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">月下，站一棵没有枝椏的树. 這棵树好像只有翅膀，所以非常相似一棵松树.

<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:SimSun;mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;mso-ascii-theme-font: minor-latin;mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri;mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">Also, SIU's hidden blog has released some more information. This time about the 43rd Floor. I'll try to get the information about Hendo, for you.

<span lang="ZH-CN" style="font-family:SimSun;mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;mso-ascii-theme-font: minor-latin;mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri;mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">Is it possible to work on the stuff about the Ranking office and this?

<span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;text-align:center;">2012/06/29 01:18

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">http://inutero3334.blog.me/140162345654

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">1.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이수가 쿤과 대화하기 위해 방을 나간 후로

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아낙 자하드와 엔도르시 자하드는 침묵의 시간을 보내고 있었다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">항상 마른 성냥처럼 상대방과 마찰을 일으키지 못해 안달인 엔도르시였지만

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">오늘 밤만은 비에 젖은 듯 힘을 잃고 늘어져 있었다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"...왜 우리와 함께 가기로 결정한 거야?"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">마지 못 해 아낙이 엔도르시에게 말을 건다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">엔도르시는 침대에 몸을 가로누운 채로 아낙을 흘끗 쳐다보더니

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"글쎄.."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">라면서 말을 흐린다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"...나와 함께 가면 자하드의 공주 자리가 위험해질 수도 있어"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"그걸 알면서도 함께 가겠다는 거야?"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">계속된 아낙의 질문에도 엔도르시는 한참을 천장을 바라보며 대답을 늦췄다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그리고는 엉뚱한 질문으로 아낙을 당황시켰다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"마뱀, 너 어머니와 떨어져 있던 그 몇 년 간.. 어디에 있었어?"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"..뭐?"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"알려줘, 왕궁의 재수탱이들 조차 찾아내지 못하는 그 곳을. 내가 나중에 거기에서 살고 싶으니까."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"...."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이번엔 아낙이 대답을 늦춘다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아낙은 그녀 답지 않은 심각한 얼굴로 곰곰히 생각하더니

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">뭔가를 결심한 듯 입을 떼기 시작했다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"43층."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"!!"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아낙의 말을 들은 엔도르시의 눈의 초점이 빠르게 흔들리며 이동한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">천장의 라이트에서, 천장과 벽면의 이음매에서,

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">단순한 패턴의 벽지를 지나 아낙 자하드에게로.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아직 빛의 잔상이 남아있어 시큼해진 눈을 껌뻑이지도 않은 채로

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">엔도르시는 아낙에게 묻는다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"43층!? 엔류가 나타났던 곳?"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"그래."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"그 곳은 관리자가 없는 죽음의 층이잖아? 네가 그 곳에서 어떻게..?"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아낙은 자세를 고쳐잡으며 숨을 고른다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">과연 이 이야기를 엔도르시에게 해도 되는 것일까.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">찬란한 미래가 기다리고 있는 어린 공주에게 자신의 불행을 나눠주는 꼴이 되지 않을까.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">복잡한 생각이 그녀의 머릿 속을 파고 든다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">하지만 이제 어찌할 수 없는 일이다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">눈 앞의 그녀는 당장이라도 불을 붙여줘야 할 것 처럼 매말라 있었으니까.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그래서 아낙은 그녀에게

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">아주 작은 불씨만을 던져주기로 결심했다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"가람 자하드."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"그녀가 그 곳에 있어."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">[출처] 2.|작성자 SIU

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">Tofu21 19:08, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Wow, how long is your list of to-dos? You mean like... a few weeks' worth of things to do, huh?

Comprehensive Info on the Tower Preview form< what's this?

I hope your friend, Giga5000 will come around again.

Also, hendo's profile:

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">헨도 록 블러드메더

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이명: 장수거북 ( long life sea turtle)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">나이: ???

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">키:13M 27cm

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">출생지: ???

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">포지션: 디펜더(특수 포지션)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">랭킹: 16

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">탑 100층의 관리자는 자신의 시험을 통과한 댓가로

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">자하드와 위대한 10가주들에게 영생을 선물한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">하지만 그 중 단 한 사람만이 예외가 되었으니

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그가 바로 헨도 가문의 가주, 블러드메더다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(정확한 이유는 알려져 있지 않다.)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">블러드메더는 관리자에게 자신이 영생할 수 있는 방법을 알려달라 빌었고

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">관리자는 단 하나의 조건을 내걸었다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"만약 너의 아이, 그 아이의 아이들 모두에게 단명하는 저주를 내린다면"

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">"그 아이들의 생명을 받은 너는 홀로 영생할 수 있을 것이다."

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">블러드메더는 고민했지만,

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">죽음에 대한 공포를 이겨낼 수 없었다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">결국 블러드메더는 관리자에게 자신을 영생하게 해달라 빌었고

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이후 블러드메더의 피를 이어받은 자들은 모두 단명하게 되었다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(물론 탑에서의 단명은 100살 정도이다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">랭커일 경우는 좀 더 길다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">하지만 헨도의 자식들은 절대로 영생할 수 없다.)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이후 블러드메더는 자신의 수명을 연장시키기 위해서

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">많은 자식들을 가져야만 했는데,

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">10가문 중 가장 많은 자식을 가진 자가 바로 블러드메더다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(가장 많은 부인을 가진 자는 쿤 에드안이다)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이는 그가 바친 자신들의 목숨만큼 수명을 연장받기로 관리자와 약속했기 때문인데

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">정확한 계약의 내용에 대해서는 아무도 아는 바가 없지만

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그의 수명이 늘어나면 늘어날수록 많은 자식을 유지해야 되는 건 분명해 보인다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이런 저주 덕분인지 헨도 집안은 10가문 중에서도 가장 세가 약한 편이며

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">랭커의 수도 가장 적다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">하지만 가장 철통같은 규율 아래 유지, 운영되고 있으며

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">가문 내에서의 블러드메더의 위치는 절대적이다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(헨도 가문의 중역을 맡고 있는 랭커들은 모두 헨도의 양자, 양녀들이다.)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">한편 헨도 집안의 피를 이어받은 자식들은

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">자신이 헨도 집안임을 속이고 혼인하고는 하는데

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">이런 '사기혼인' 덕분에 블러드메더의 피는 탑 전역에 퍼지게 되었고

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">결국 탑에서는 '블러드메더'의 피를 가진 자들을 분류해내는데 상당한 힘을 쓰고 있다고 한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">블러드메더의 이명인 장수거북은

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">영생을 향한 그의 집착에 대한 조롱의 뜻과 함께

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그의 포지션과도 밀접한 관련이 있다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">그는 디펜더라는 특이한 포지션을 소화하는데

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">창지기나 등대지기를 보호하는 역할을 맡는 포지션이다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">탑 역사상 가장 강력한 창지기인 쿤 에드안과 그의 콤비는 누구도 막기 힘들었다고 한다.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">(물론 블러드메더는 모든 포지션을 훌륭히 소화해낼 수 있다.)

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;text-align:center;color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">[출처] 인물도감 16 - 헨도 록 블러드메더 |작성자 SIU

Tofu21 19:38, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

<span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">Oh yes, Gizmos forgot to include the comment SIU made, under Hendo's profile. 유한성과 관련이 깊은 인물입니다. 3빠. I'll update your previous section too.

<span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">Also, got all that. Well, Wikis can be a pain to edit. And wikia is a bit meh... if it weren't for my love of TOG, I would stay far away from wikis. They tend to make my head go round. :P

<span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica,arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:22px;">Tofu21 20:22, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Translating for a group
Hello GoDai, I'm Trebor, an admin of The Company. I noticed that you seem to be a dedicated translator; we're currently recruiting for more translators to join our group. If you have any interest in joining a group instead of (or in addition to) freelancing, we'd love for you to consider us. Thanks for reading! - TreborTheGreat 04:53, June 29, 2012 (UTC)


 * Uh, about average? Lol... forum signup isn't really any more complicated than the average forum... Not quite sure how describe this :P - TreborTheGreat 23:15, June 29, 2012 (UTC)


 * Right, I understand that you're busy. Could you make an account on our forums and PM me? I want to run something by you privately. Thanks. - TreborTheGreat 02:20, June 30, 2012 (UTC)

Demonic hanja coming our way
Ah, I forgot to tell you. Just attribute the contributor of the hidden links to "Anonymous". Gizmos doesn't want to reveal her identity.

Tofu21 09:22, June 30, 2012 (UTC)

Ah lol... btw, I enabled commenting on that new article you made.

Also, for long posts, I never ever ever write them directly in Wikia. I save them in Word or something with autosave feature. :P

Tofu21 11:02, June 30, 2012 (UTC)

Computers, doing what computers do: annoying users when they go on strike. :p I guess notepad is more convenient than Word or some similar application. Autocorrect can be so annoying.

Well, the "Computers" part was adapted from the "Triangle Man" part on this page:

http://www.cakewrecks.com/home/2009/8/21/two-words-bakeries.html

http://www.cakewrecks.com/home/2012/3/29/sheep-who-must-not-be-named.html

Also, 포켓 = pokae/poke?

And 완드 = wandeu ?

Tofu21 12:59, June 30, 2012 (UTC)

That's why I run everything through you, instead of going "wheeee! lets add everything to the site." :P Btw, where does your username come from?

I'm gonna be absent for some time 'cos of laptop trouble.

Ah well, some of the cakes on that site, believe it or not, were made by artisans who started off as novices. ^^;; The "cake wrecks" are entertaining to laugh at, though.

There are of course the "Sunday Sweets" selections where the cakes actually look awesome.

I saw the new video you posted. Haha, yes, their relationship is super complicated. Well, whatever happened, poor Baam. :P Then again, some people can be very emotional. God help the poor person who faces their wrath and that emotional explosion. =P

Tofu21 10:44, July 1, 2012 (UTC)

Thanks but I just clump them together. >>;; :P You, GoDai, can know the sound, just by looking. I have to look at the charts.

That's actually the Chinese elemental system too. Erm, a shame I don't know much about that. Not good in science, unfortunately lol...

My computer seems to have problems with the mouse function. Trying to fix it, atm.

<p style="margin-top:1em;margin-bottom:1em;">Ah, some people just don't get it until you have to hit them in the head. That sounds like our Baam. He didn't understand why Rachel wanted to get away from him and he still doesn't.

I agree the nice ones look really good and yummy. Yeah, the cakes... lol. For the sheep cake, the bonnet, teeth and the eyes just made it worse. :P O man, I can't stop laughing when I think of the poor person who ended up with that sheep cake. I too can't take much sweet foods 'cos it's like "brain freeze". x_X;;

Also believe it or not, some of the wrecks are made by real artisans.

She's supposed to be a Ritz Carlton cake/pastry chef, right? Look what happened, lol.

http://www.cakewrecks.com/home/2010/5/7/she-turned-in-her-own-mother.html

Tailse User Story
Just wondering if you'd like me to typeset what you've got of Tailse User Story, mostly because it's nicer to read with the text on the image ^.^ and if so if it's read left to right or right to left? &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 01:40, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

If you compress all the images into a rar file, then upload them somewhere e.g. mediafire, then give me the download link, then I can typeset it (it's just nicer for the english readers to have picture and text together), but it's up to you because they're your translations :) &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 04:14, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

I'm in no rush :) &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 04:30, July 2, 2012 (UTC)

Exis, Tower, Phantaminum, Rachel, etc.
Btw, Urek knows phantaminum/pentaminum is an exis, doesn't he? That's why he chased after him into the Tower.

Great, if Penta doesn't appear in TOG, then it's going to make Urek's efforts so futile lol...

Tofu21 03:34, July 9, 2012 (UTC)

I too would feel greatly disappointed since SIU has mentioned links of Penta to Urek Mazino. Hah, so many possibilities why Phantaminum is staying in the Tower. Yes, that sounds very interesting. Maybe he wants to awaken an Exis or he wants to awaken another Exis like Urek or Enryu. Perhaps he's also searching for something? It's possible he's also searching for someone and that person may not be Rachel or Baam but someone else.

Btw, do you think he can teleport himself? He managed to enter the Tower without being chosen(or so it seems), appeared on Floor 134(either near or inside the perimeter of the Outer Palaces) and then vanished after facing Zahard. It seems as an Exis, he maybe can override the restrictions placed by the Guardian.

Damn, so many mysteries! How did Rachel even come across the book that spoke about the Tower? Was it in a dead language or something else? It sounded like quite a rarity or oddity, the type you find after years of research and talking to people. Plus, it seems very difficult to enter the Tower. A total of 13 Irregulars(minus Penta) entered the Tower but that was over a period of 10,000 years, before Baam and Rachel entered. For some reason, Rachel was familiar with the entire process of being teleported into the Tower and that may be why she didn't get worked up. Tofu21 18:39, July 10, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, I didn't know those things about Exises. Amazing how much information is missing, for us English users. So he is fast as hell, like some sports car. :P Yeah, maybe he's unable to destroy the place?

Enryu, Enryu... are you already dead? Or are you off baking cookies for some charity sale, like a boy scout? :P

Well, it seems the Guides only came after Zahard's time(or something). So there is no way non-Exises would know about the Empire. I actually would be disappointed if in-depth details about the Tower were common knowledge among Tower outsiders, since it makes the place "not so special or less mysterious". =P

Though one thing is truly strange: how did the 11 Irregulars manage to find their way around the Tower, if people now need a Guide? Did they get help from the Tower or Masceth? Or perhaps the Light Bearer did that.

The door... so giant and massive and mysterious. It seems people are teleported are across some distance before they're teleported into the Tower. It doesn't seem to have handles(on the inside), btw. I'd like to see what the Tower looks like, from the outside.

Well at least, SIU hasn't done this to the characters: "There is no exact form of Floor ___ and it's all in your mind and your perceptions".

Btw, a quick question: do the Royal Guide and Royal Guard also join the Zahard Family as an organisation? And oops, you really want to divide up your Talk Page, it's really lengthy. :O Sorry, GoDai! :)

Tofu21 20:56, July 11, 2012 (UTC)

<p style="margin-top:1em;margin-bottom:1em;">I can't wait for Enryu, either. Well for consistency, I listed them both as Tower outsiders for the time being. But yeah, who knows... it's all so fuzzy.

If they lived in the Outer tower, somehow they get to enter the door. And maybe, the cave is just some artificial habitat like a cell. Or where they grew up in, is super remote and the people are totally rural and have never heard of Shinsoo or Guardians before(just kidding, too many stereotypes here... lol). Still, maybe that's true and they're completely unaware of what the Tower is.

Either that or outside the Tower, there are places where people live in some giant enclosure where the only "sky" is the ceiling. And the logo maybe belongs to Zahard's clan or some place used by Exis or someone else. Damnit, how long is SIU gonna hold out on this? This ajumma will be so sad if it takes another year to get some answers.

Aiya, my mistake. I meant to say they "might have come" after his time. It's possible Guides may have existed long before Zahard arrived. Otherwise, how did people walk around on a Floor if it's all dark and there are Shinheuh walking around?

Oohkay, i will have to edit some pages to reflect that, which will have to wait. Thanks for going the extra mile and you're awesome. ^^

Just reformatted and already I hate Windows7. Lets see if Linux will run. Plus, I'm still having net issues. .__.

And ah about Shinheuh, yep here we go(supposedly in the English version, TC referred to the Bull as a Shinheuh): http://comic.naver.com/webtoon/detail.nhn?titleId=183559&amp;no=65&amp;weekday=mon

Tofu21 (talk) 17:01, July 12, 2012 (UTC)

25F
Hi ~ I just needed to confirm that Agero is on 25F. A couple people are saying that it was never confirmed and I'm trying to say that it was. Could you just check Naver so I know my reading hasn't died? :P

High Ranker Number Three - Zahard 03:53, July 12, 2012 (UTC)

Hmmm... thanks. :)

High Ranker Number Three - Zahard 05:09, July 12, 2012 (UTC)

Eh, I thought only Irregulars could request to take a Guardian's test ? Then again, maybe it was different in their times.

Yeah well, no idea how they got around on the floors if only Irregulars could ascend the Floors. I don't even know how those people got there, maybe they were created using Shinsoo.

Btw, "although in Zahard's case it's a bit different because he's the King and society works quite differently in the Tower" <--- what is different?

And ty, things are running well for now, in Linux. :) Btw, keep up the good work with translating! :D

Tofu21 (talk) 07:26, July 14, 2012 (UTC)

Hey GoDai, just wondering if you could please translate this speech bubble, that'd be great :) http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/8137/karamorgaram.png &#34;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&#34; (talk) 06:54, July 15, 2012 (UTC)

Thank you! I needed that because The Company translated it as Karam, and several people thought it might be Garam, and thanks to you I know it is ^.^ &#34;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&#34; (talk) 09:48, July 15, 2012 (UTC)

You and every other translator except for Grumpy went with the g so I'm thinking it's the best choice. &quot;I am Brutalitops! The Magician...Magic user baby, whaaat?&quot; 00:20, July 16, 2012 (UTC)

questions
vol 2 chap 35 : its mentioned "from 30th floor you get only one chance per year" (or something to that effect)

that means:

1) you can cross only one floor a year... or...

2) each floor can be attempted only once a year.

can you clarify with siu which is the case? (i assume you know how to reach him or know someone who knows how to etc etc)

if his (its a guy right?) reply is case 1, then ask how did mazino cover the tower in 50 years. it would've taken a hundred years at the least. (his reply mite be a 'restriction was put up after mazino's entrance' - but that would frankly not make sense so ask him to make it as case 2 for the good of the story - since its not confirmed yet anywhere)

if his reply is case 2, then i've a question that needs asking anyway. can a climber cross 20+ floors in a year? cos thats the only way mazino could've climbed the tower. there's also a question of whether phantaminum came directly to zahard's floor without actually climbing the tower (thats what his 'legend' sounds like) but we can forget that for now - too many q's.

hope you find out! (and reply to this same talk page pls, cos i'm not a member here - so haven't signed this post either)